ErstQuake 3

mshiflet · Post by **mshiflet** » Thu Nov 02, 2006 6:44 am

what kind of plugs were you using? regular foam freebies? it's kind of a catch-22 for casual fans of this stuff. real quality plugs can cost several hundred dollars, and the cheapest i would recommend are still around $20. understandable that they can be a distraction at first. i've had the same pair for several years - kind of gross now that i think about it - and even they can get annoying every now and then.

mrselvig · Post by **mrselvig** » Thu Nov 02, 2006 12:29 pm

If anyone can make recommendations for "real quality plugs," I'd love to hear about them - are there certain brands that are best for music use? Do you have to go through an audiologist to get the best ones? Sorry if this was already covered in the tinnitus thread... I'd be fine with spending a lot for really good plugs - my experience has been that I have a lot of problems with fit, much like what Richard says, when I use the supposedly better ones you can get at music stores. Cheap foam ones deaden sound too much and take a lot of enjoyment out of concerts.

jkudler · Post by **jkudler** » Thu Nov 02, 2006 12:40 pm

even the "nice" ones i had weren't that great. at some point, i want to just shell out for the custom jobs. i bring them to shows a lot, but i hardly ever wear them, since they totally distract and kill the high end for me. even for band practice, i find it so hard to focus and listen with them, but my bandmates tell me i'm nuts. and they're metal dudes!

it's a difficult compromise for me. i wore plugs for very few erstquake sets, i think. jazkamer caught me when my brain (and laptop) had really collapsed, so i just went outside for some of it. i think maybe i did some selected ear-covering for lescalleet.

-j.

Richard Pinnell · Post by **Richard Pinnell** » Thu Nov 02, 2006 1:28 pm

They were cheap shoddy earplugs from one of the pharmacies I manage. remind me to fire the buyer

rainey · Post by **rainey** » Thu Nov 02, 2006 11:04 pm

i personally just walk out when i feel that earplugs are necessary. i did a ten day tour w/emile beaulieau and never felt the need for earplugs. i've seen borbetomagus a number of times and also, as recently mentioned, maryanne amacher (not to mention pink floyd, twice, and dio...). never felt the need for earplugs and am pretty sure my hearing is aok (had a test not long ago). sets that hurt my ears are usually victims of poor sound systems (which, i think, a good musician should take into consideration rather than ignore), crappy musicianship, or just blunt, aggressive behavior (which does not necessarily include slaying a robot dragon with a burning guitar solo). no music is worth the loss of your hearing, and earplugs, for me, delete a significant area of the sound spectrum. so, why bother? if it hurts, go have a drink somewhere else.

or do what you want... just my 2 cents, which are way cheaper than fine earplugs...

jon abbey · Post by **jon abbey** » Thu Nov 02, 2006 11:27 pm

yeah, that's exactly how I feel. I stood near the back for the mattin/barnes set and left for sections of the phill/jason and jazkamer sets (although at least in part because I was burnt out by then). I personally didn't find the dilloway/marhaug set painfully loud, I was too busy wallowing in it.

it's not really on topic, but maryanne amacher installation here at issue project at the end of november! you guys have me way excited for that.

mshiflet · Post by **mshiflet** » Fri Nov 03, 2006 5:07 am

i see your point, but i have the fucked situation of being a huge noise fan who also has extremely sensitive ears. i'd miss out on more than half the shows i've seen the past decade if i didn't have them. and i still haven't shelled out for custom jobs, though the type lasse had seem very worthy with -25, -15, -9db filters with full sprectrum reduction. i think he said he used the 15s for watching sets and the 9s for when he was playing. i'd love a set if i had a few hundred bucks to spare.

user_265 · Post by **user_265** » Fri Nov 03, 2006 8:37 pm

a stupid question maybe, but why does a musician wear earplugs during his own set... i mean, wouldn't it be easier to just turn it down a little?

jkudler · Post by **jkudler** » Sat Nov 04, 2006 1:36 am

tomas wrote:a stupid question maybe, but why does a musician wear earplugs during his own set... i mean, wouldn't it be easier to just turn it down a little?

i always wonder about this.

well, some things work better loud. or because of your bandmates.

-j.

faster · Post by **faster** » Sat Nov 04, 2006 1:37 am

I've thought about that too, but people who like to play with big volume usually cite the physical effect on the body, not just the ears, as a reason for doing so. I can understand that, even if you plug your ears completely big volume can thump you right in the sternum.

vegetable mind · Post by **vegetable mind** » Sat Nov 04, 2006 1:37 am

i understand when you are a drummer or in a band with drums, because being in that proximity to drums makes them noticeably louder

mshiflet · Post by **mshiflet** » Sat Nov 04, 2006 3:24 am

i think erstquake actually showed exactly when/why its a good idea: lasse, aaron, john and jason were all playing right in front of their amps, having opted for amp setups over (or in addition to) the PA. the limited stage space made that setup the only real solution. i've been in this prediciment several times myself, most recently when i played with yellow swans in columbus. even at mid-volume, it's not very fun to have your head directly in front of a horn and/or tweeter. situations such as this are generally the only times i play with plugs in though. mine aren't good enough (and often i don't find them necessary) for regular performances.

user_265 · Post by **user_265** » Sat Nov 04, 2006 6:44 am

yeah, i understand the argument about "physicality", that can be a good reason.

shiflet wrote:it's not very fun to have your head directly in front of a horn and/or tweeter.

that makes sense, unless your name is karkowski or ottavi or mattin. some people really seem to enjoy that feeling.

bryan · Post by **bryan** » Sat Nov 04, 2006 8:25 pm

Faster wrote:I've thought about that too, but people who like to play with big volume usually cite the physical effect on the body, not just the ears, as a reason for doing so. I can understand that, even if you plug your ears completely big volume can thump you right in the sternum.

Totally.. but maybe it'd be better to just lay the low end on really thick and be easy on the high frequencies - you'd have the physical effects without needing earplugs. But then this needs a kickass sound system.. subs, etc.. and good control over the instrument sound.

A friend gave me Etymotic earplugs and they're the best I've used - supposed to attenuate all freqeuncies equally and they fit well, but I don't like wearing them in general.

William Hutson · Post by **William Hutson** » Sat Nov 04, 2006 11:10 pm

while they don't feel as physically uncomfortable, low frequencies are more damaging to hearing than high ones-- or so i've heard and never thought to question before.

i wear these expensive suctiony earplugs at almost every show i go to. at erstquake, ernst karel showed me his custom dealies which he claimed were worth ten times their weight in gold.

tomas wrote:yeah, i understand the argument about "physicality", that can be a good reason.

i think of damion romero. his stuff is so physical, certain frequencies activate different parts of your body. during one solo set, i was lying flat against the floor, some moments rattled my teeth, some moments made me laugh because the vibrations actually tickled. weird.

jkudler · Post by **jkudler** » Sun Nov 05, 2006 2:09 am

http://www.chunklet.com/index.cfm?secti ... ID=8&ID=50" onclick= "window.open(this.href);return false;

bryan · Post by **bryan** » Sun Nov 05, 2006 4:30 am

William Hutson wrote:while they don't feel as physically uncomfortable, low frequencies are more damaging to hearing than high ones-- or so i've heard and never thought to question before.

From what I understand that's not the case... high frequencies are usually the first to go, and not only that, but low frequency stuff is "heard" through the bones of the skull vs. mid-high frequencies which are detected by the little cilia "hairs" of the inner ear - and those are the puppies that die and never come back.

mshiflet · Post by **mshiflet** » Sun Nov 05, 2006 4:32 am

sadly ironic that the chunklet article includes a quote from Jason DiEmillio of Azusa Plane ("so I think you are sort of a pussy if you wear earplugs but if you don't, you end up losing your hearing and it's not worth it.") as just last week he took his own life after struggling with severe hearing issues which had made music physically impossible for him for the past few years. has that been mentioned elsewhere on the board? terrible.

faster · Post by **faster** » Sun Nov 05, 2006 5:02 am

I had not heard that. That is terrible.