150 People In The World: the Wire magazine

[Cornelis]

I really don't think that the people who read the Wire are going to have a heart attack if some sine waves 'n' silence stuff pops up next to Matthew Shipp or something.

http://www.approximation-festival.de/




Cor

[AlbionMoonlight]

Ahahaha. Brilliant.

[jon abbey]

what's really a shame is that Nick Cain doesn't post here, he used to be on the zorn-list back in the day. I'm sure he at least lurks, maybe he'll deign to drop by sometime...

[niwi]

What's EAI?

jazz

[Dohol]

What's EAI?

jazz

Yeah, it's funky..

[RFKorp]

What's EAI?

jazz

Yeah, it's funky..

But does it swing?

[joeperucki]

"Nick Cain, in the latest Wire page 81"]For the 150 people in the world who STILL care about electroacoustic improvisation (EAI)

Are the numbers down? (part kidding part serious)

[jpeatt]

Can I be put down for one of those tshirts?

If I was going to read a couple of thousand words on Robert Ashley, I'd like to think the Wire would be a place one could do so, but they will insist on devoting the space to full page photos of the man instead.

[Chromosome]

but they will insist on devoting the space to full page photos of the man instead.

are there still 150 people in the world who take The Wire seriously?

Are there 150 people who can read the Wire outside the bathroom?

burns

[skrobek]

this would have been a good thread for the challenge skrobek deleted elsewhere.

wanna try again, julien? it wouldn't be off-topic here.

m

well, as I said if you go to a pop-rock forum you will find many fans criticizing the magazines that devote an article to their beloved band, mainly blaming them for being too general or inaccurate in some places...

When I started reading the Wire years ago most of the artists mentionned were new to me, except for the big free jazz names. I could have gone on the Internet and find out about them, but I always get the feeling it's hard to discover something on the Internet, while it's really easy to find what you are looking for.

Of course, today if I want news about Taku Sugimoto for instance, I won't wait for the Wire, because I've got forums, newsletters and made friends with some well-informed people, sometimes with the artists themselves.

But I still love The Wire for what it is, a generalist magazine dealing with music other magazines don't deal with. Of course it can't be specialized in every sub-niche it deals with, but that's the point for me. I'm not expecting a double-page on the Encadre guys or anything, but where else in the International music press can you read such a nice article (with great pictures btw) on Ghedalia Tazartes as was published in the last issue ?

The answer is nowhere. Same thing with the Michel Chion article. Of course there are tons of bios and articles discussing Chion in depth available elesewhere, but I'll never get myself to investigate them if someone doesn't make me aware. I was like "Oh yeah, Chion, I should read more about him".

So I'm still expecting the Wire every month, and reading it from cover to cover. I think the standard of writing is pretty high in general, a point on which you all seem to disagree here... and when I happen to spot an inaccuracy because I'm very familiar with the subject, well I'm just amused because it makes me feel like a "hardcore fan" or "a member of the scene", but it doesn't provoke any ire.

OK now bring it on

[Richard Pinnell]

What gets me is the idea that in some way The Wire has got worse in recent years, as if it was once a home for endless reviews and articles on EAI, or that it was ever any more "up to the minute" than it is now. The Wire has been essentially the same for over a decade now, a magazine trying to cover a wide area of music as best as it can, but coming up short in a number of areas. The reviews are too short, and often content-free, the pictures take up more space than the writing (though an online forum about graphic design would be applauding this remember) and its inevitably out of date. My point is that it hasn't changed. It has had nameless Berlin techno musicians on the cover for years only for them to disappear within weeks, writing on EAI or related music has always been limited to what Dan or one or two others could lever in between the Matthew Shipp and Bjork articles. Its not a great magazine when compared to something like IHM, but then it never has been!

The Wire was once hugely important for me, in the days before I had access to the internet. I fed off of the scraps it offered on the music I enjoyed, and the gig listings page was very important for me. I still subscribe, though rarely read much of the magazine these days because there is little there that the internet didn't tell me about weeks ago. The gig listings though are still absolutely vital to me and believe it or not they often remain the first place I read about events. Its beyond me that no one anywhere has managed to set up a worldwide listings resource for upcoming gigs. We badly need this and it really wouldn't be hard to do. Someone out there with more time on their hands than I have should do this!

My point is that people should stop complaining about something that hasn't really changed in a long while. The Wire is what it is and has been for some time and you either buy it or you don't. The general feeling around here that its "not what it used to be" is a bit pointless if you ask me.

[jon abbey]

I don't agree with that, sorry. I've also been reading it for a long time, since before issue 100 (they're on 297 now), and I think the level of writing/insight has dropped a fair amount in that time. yes, my perspective has changed in that time, but also the staff there have gotten older, and they're not bringing in adequate replacements (partly because they own the magazine now). as we all know, one's passion/fanaticism for music tends to drop as one gets older and life crowds in and jadedness takes over (yes, there are exceptions, but that's a safe general rule). ironically for this thread, Nick Cain was the one major exception to this in recent times, but he left his job as reviews editor quite quickly, and also doesn't write nearly as much as I was hoping he would. and this isn't an EAI-centric perspective, as Richard correctly says, that's never been a great strength of theirs, it's an overall perspective.

anyway, coincidentally I had a long back and forth subway trip last night, and read the bulk of the last two issues. almost totally worthless (a hilariously superficial/irrelevant Primer on "the Alternate Neil Young" which just covered some of his actual releases and looked like pretty much any other best of Neil piece was a lowlight), with the exception of one great one by Bill Shoemaker (mistakenly credited on the index page as Bill Meyer, correctly credited in the article) on Anthony Braxton circa 1974 to coincide with the Arista/Mosaic box, fantastic research on this, tons of things I didn't know before.

[jon abbey]

The gig listings though are still absolutely vital to me and believe it or not they often remain the first place I read about events. Its beyond me that no one anywhere has managed to set up a worldwide listings resource for upcoming gigs. We badly need this and it really wouldn't be hard to do. Someone out there with more time on their hands than I have should do this!

that's funny to hear, I seriously don't ever remember reading about an interesting show/festival there I didn't know about already, although that's probably mostly because 1) they're quite London-centric, which is completely understanadable and justifiable, but they are and 2) I don't usually bother looking at those until I finish the magazine, which usually is a few weeks after it shows up.

[jon abbey]

oh, I should also mention that their dub column roundup is usually quite good, I look forward to that whenever it runs.

[Richard Pinnell]

Back before issue 100 the magazine was much more focussed on a tighter area of music (Jazz) and so yes if we go back that far then it has changed. Those early issues include a lot of well researched material by people that knew the area of music in question well. I started reading the magazine then too, though ironically because I was far more interested in its lovely design back then. I had little interest in the music written about. Issues 100-130 are indeed a little better as they tended to include more writing that did not focus on individual artists, and so allowed the writer more opportunity to pose questions, but we are still going back 13 years for this. I really think that it hasn't changed much over the last decade or so, from either a quality or range of music discussed perspective.

I agree with your assessments of recent issues Jon, but I've also read of your disdain for the publication for about five years now. I just wonder why we keep on asking the same questions about the magazine year after year instead of just giving up on it? It really doesn't look like its about to change for the better any time soon.

[jon abbey]

I agree with your assessments of recent issues Jon, but I've also read of your disdain for the publication for about five years now. I just wonder why we keep on asking the same questions about the magazine year after year instead of just giving up on it? It really doesn't look like its about to change for the better any time soon.

I'm not asking any questions, I agree that it's not likely going to change for the better. I still subscribe because I feel like I have to given my job running Erst/ErstDist, but that doesn't mean that I don't think it's mostly a massive wasted opportunity and that I'm not going to state my opinions if someone else is defending it beyond where it should be defended IMO.

as for this thread specifically, I expect a bit better from Nick Cain, not from the mag in general.

[Richard Pinnell]

I'm not asking any questions, I agree that it's not likely going to change for the better. I still subscribe because I feel like I have to given my job running Erst/ErstDist, but that doesn't mean that I don't think it's mostly a massive wasted opportunity and that I'm not going to state my opinions if someone else is defending it beyond where it should be defended IMO.

OK, I agree with all of that and find myself in a very similar position. Every year when I renew my subscription I ask myself why I am doing so, but somehow still do it.

[skrobek]

I think it's always frustrating to read something in a generalist magazine about any topic you know everything about, down to the minute details.

However, if you read about things you don't already know about, it's always a door opened...

[will]

I think it's always frustrating to read something in a generalist magazine about any topic you know everything about, down to the minute details.

However, if you read about things you don't already know about, it's always a door opened...

Sure, and I started reading the Wire a decade ago, after spending the 90's reading tons of metal and punk zines. The breadth of coverage was surprising, and a little confusing. I think that we care about The Wire because it's the only magazine that covers such a broad range of music and is so widely distributed; I really appreciate being able to buy it (at several different bookshops) in Beirut, for example.
I think that Richard's right, it hasn't changed that much in the last ten years. The basic sites of production of the music that it covers haven't changed that much either, but general access to information about that music and those sites has; this is what I was pointing out in my first post. I really think that the Wire, and regional publications like it, need to refocus on what they can provide that the internet can't.
As others are saying here and in the "critics" thread, I'd be much more interested in longer articles by good writers / area experts. Follow a season of contemporary composition festivals, tell me lots about the global absorption of Bollywood hits, explain how mp3 blogs and messageboards have changed things: find the stories that are there, but aren't getting covered by some jerk like me posting a hundred word review of some obscure eai record on ihm.
At this point, I buy the Wire (and STN), skim it for things that interest me, and toss it on a shelf, not bothering to read 90% of it because I know that there's just not going to be much cross-talk between reviews, articles, and features. Magazines like The Sound Projector can get away with just having tons of reviews because they're all written by one quirky guy, the magazine as a whole documents his personality as much as it does the music it covers. I really think that the only generalist print publication with the reach the Wire has can be doing more than that.

[jkudler]

i agree with will - it'd nice to see the wire do what print does best, longer and more in-depth, well-researched pieces that i want to dive into. the little one-page round-ups (and really, the longer reviews too) are mostly useless and seem intended to keep people sending them discs and to keep all those reviewed buying copies.

i do think the magazine has changed, though. pulling out random old issues, it always strikes me that there seem to be A LOT more interesting articles, cover artists, etc. it's so rare now that there's an issue i really want to dive into, whereas a random one from say 2001 seems to have several pieces i am STILL curious to read. now, that number is far less, though sometimes the writing is still very good (the necks piece from a few months back comes to mind). but mostly it covers stuff that seems a bit either "WTF" or "eh" to me. also, the slightly exoticizing coverage of a lot of (to me, of course) very bland american music is disappointing. i guess it's keenan, and it probably started with that "new weird america" issue, but i find both the coverage and tone of their treatment of american underground music fairly useless and redundant.

that said, it's also important to keep in mind how much the internet has changed things in 10 years. then, it was nearly impossible to have a connected, global "EAI scene" a la what goes on here. it was also pretty hard to hear a lot of new records. now, we can be much more focused and specific, and quicker with info. i also find that i have far less interest in record reviews - particularly very brief and not-thoughtful ones - when it's so easy to hear audio clips online of nearly everything. i'd rather just check something out that sit through turgid descriptions that make, i don't know. . . nmperign and english sound exactly the same. "hisses, crackles, and whooshes tell us that these instruments *aren't* being played as their makers intended. the players build up a focused and steely layering of texture, preferring amm's 'laminal' approach to the give-and-take of older improv forms."

that seems to be like 90% of the improv reviews in both the wire and STN.

-jesse